What is the difference ??
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So long story short l have access to my sons instagram so that l can check he is sticking to his bail conditions etc and there is no issue with him in relation to this... a girl that he has followed at some time in the past (not sure when from or why) posted an update on her page today... basically it was her birthday and she is posing in lingerie in front of a 15 year old sign.. none of her other photos indicate her age and to be fair other photos make her look older.. suffice it to say my son has deleted her from his following list.. My question is firstly why do girls seem to think posting pictures like this on insta is appropriate and secondly as l see this is a cat c image, should she not be investigated for distribution.. what hope do teenage males and young men who are maybe not as mature as others have in this current world.. another one to add to the reasons l hate social media...
Calling for a teenage girl to be investigated for distribution is an absurd legal reach and a textbook example of shifting accountability. The law is clear, it does not prosecute teenagers for self-generated photos. They are minors navigating an intense digital culture, not criminal distributors.
Blaming a young woman's post for what men choose to view is a dangerous line of thinking that mirrors incel rhetoric. It completely removes male accountability. Young men and adults are entirely responsible for their own choices, their own clicks, and what they allow on their feeds. Trying to criminalise a teenage girl to excuse male behavior is entirely unacceptable
Blaming a young woman's post for what men choose to view is a dangerous line of thinking that mirrors incel rhetoric. It completely removes male accountability. Young men and adults are entirely responsible for their own choices, their own clicks, and what they allow on their feeds. Trying to criminalise a teenage girl to excuse male behavior is entirely unacceptable
I agree Dad in limbo. This whole subject, sex and the way it is viewed/ dealt with in society/ media/ social media is filled with contradictions and inconsistencies.
Indeed, the law may choose not to prosecute but the fact remains however that sharing self generated indecent images, even by teens, is illegal.
It is true that many of these girls who are posting stuff are confused youngsters trying to navigate an increasingly confusing digital world, but the same *can also be said for many of the teen boys who end up seeing it. Yes kids can block accounts, but only once they have seen stuff, images that in this case it seems were not wanted or asked for. Young people are given mixed messages and I don't think it is 'incel' to ask questions about why young girls are posting stuff that could be categorized as Cat C. We as parents and as a society I think should be asking ourselves what are we teaching our kids- about relationships, self worth, respect, consent, that posting oneself in lingerie is actually a thing.
Indeed, the law may choose not to prosecute but the fact remains however that sharing self generated indecent images, even by teens, is illegal.
It is true that many of these girls who are posting stuff are confused youngsters trying to navigate an increasingly confusing digital world, but the same *can also be said for many of the teen boys who end up seeing it. Yes kids can block accounts, but only once they have seen stuff, images that in this case it seems were not wanted or asked for. Young people are given mixed messages and I don't think it is 'incel' to ask questions about why young girls are posting stuff that could be categorized as Cat C. We as parents and as a society I think should be asking ourselves what are we teaching our kids- about relationships, self worth, respect, consent, that posting oneself in lingerie is actually a thing.
Not investigated for just distribution but also production!
Throwawayww90,
Please do not take my post as trying to excuse the actions of males committing sexual offences towards children or for them to not take accountability..or me calling for this girl to be investigated.. my question was valid in my opinion and l do not find what she posted to be merely navigating digital culture .. with regards to what is allowed on their feeds, my point was that my son did not ask to see this type of post and l did not expect a 15 year old girl to post such an image.. it simply is not appropriate.. and finally l think the reference to incel rhetoric was bang out of line.. l deplore the incel culture that has developed by social media (another reason l hate it).
To put things into context.. Since the age of 15 my son has received images, requests for images, had humiliating references made to him and even had attempted blackmail attempts against him, all from older females.. none of this excuses what he is currently accused of but it does contribute, as he incorrectly saw this as normal.. As l parent l feel l have failed him, for not protecting him earlier from this environment. He made some bad choices 2 to 3 years ago and tried to be someone he wasn't due to social and peer pressure and he may have to deal with the consequences in the future.. social media is a cesspit that has dragged modern culture down with it..
Please do not take my post as trying to excuse the actions of males committing sexual offences towards children or for them to not take accountability..or me calling for this girl to be investigated.. my question was valid in my opinion and l do not find what she posted to be merely navigating digital culture .. with regards to what is allowed on their feeds, my point was that my son did not ask to see this type of post and l did not expect a 15 year old girl to post such an image.. it simply is not appropriate.. and finally l think the reference to incel rhetoric was bang out of line.. l deplore the incel culture that has developed by social media (another reason l hate it).
To put things into context.. Since the age of 15 my son has received images, requests for images, had humiliating references made to him and even had attempted blackmail attempts against him, all from older females.. none of this excuses what he is currently accused of but it does contribute, as he incorrectly saw this as normal.. As l parent l feel l have failed him, for not protecting him earlier from this environment. He made some bad choices 2 to 3 years ago and tried to be someone he wasn't due to social and peer pressure and he may have to deal with the consequences in the future.. social media is a cesspit that has dragged modern culture down with it..
For reference l did research before posting my initial comment https://www.avonandsomerset.police.uk/crime-prevention-advice/protect-yourself-and-others/sexting/
I agree the blurred lines ad extremely difficult. Obviously some online viewing behaviours are clearly illegal and inappropriate. Others as you describe here are grey areas that it's really difficult to navigate as a parent, let alone steer our young people through. I see some parents sharing their teenagers in swimwear, which also feels like a line is crossed. Not saying they should be prosecuted but there are a lot of inconsistencies.
Not true that young people aren't prosecuted for self generated images in other contexts. My son is being investigated (in part) for self images taken when under 18. To my knowledge, the (older) person he sent them too isnt being investigated. Its a farce at the moment and very unfair in some parts.
Not true that young people aren't prosecuted for self generated images in other contexts. My son is being investigated (in part) for self images taken when under 18. To my knowledge, the (older) person he sent them too isnt being investigated. Its a farce at the moment and very unfair in some parts.
I would be interested to hear the LFF helplines perspective on this.
To report the girl to the police would cause an investigation that has many unforseen consequences. Her family would no doubt be horrified when police turned up at their door. PTSD and other psychological damage would inevitably follow for all concerned, as usually happens with the knock. It might take the police months to check her devices, leading to more anxiety and distress.
Anyone she has had contact with might also be investigated, including this poor lad who is on bail. Because the police are so suspicious, he would no doubt be investigated for a possible breach of his bail conditions. Devices seized, long investigation, more PTSD.
So even if, following all that heartache, the end result is NFA, then it does not take away the harm that the investigation has caused.
But at the same time, to do nothing also seems wrong. Social services maybe do need to be involved. Her school does need to be contacted, for safeguarding reasons. She needs to be told that her actions are unacceptable and potentially dangerous for her. If some man online sees that image and shares it with others, she could be blackmailed for example and forced to share more images.
It is supposed to be possible to report things like this to the Internet Watch Foundation anonymously, without police becoming involved, so I would start there. They will contact instagram and get the image taken down. What I do not know for certain is what action instagram themselves would take. Would they report it to the police or just remove the image and leave it at that?
To report the girl to the police would cause an investigation that has many unforseen consequences. Her family would no doubt be horrified when police turned up at their door. PTSD and other psychological damage would inevitably follow for all concerned, as usually happens with the knock. It might take the police months to check her devices, leading to more anxiety and distress.
Anyone she has had contact with might also be investigated, including this poor lad who is on bail. Because the police are so suspicious, he would no doubt be investigated for a possible breach of his bail conditions. Devices seized, long investigation, more PTSD.
So even if, following all that heartache, the end result is NFA, then it does not take away the harm that the investigation has caused.
But at the same time, to do nothing also seems wrong. Social services maybe do need to be involved. Her school does need to be contacted, for safeguarding reasons. She needs to be told that her actions are unacceptable and potentially dangerous for her. If some man online sees that image and shares it with others, she could be blackmailed for example and forced to share more images.
It is supposed to be possible to report things like this to the Internet Watch Foundation anonymously, without police becoming involved, so I would start there. They will contact instagram and get the image taken down. What I do not know for certain is what action instagram themselves would take. Would they report it to the police or just remove the image and leave it at that?
Some well reasoned comments as ever Edel... l totally agree with the safeguarding comments.. l think more needs to be done in schools etc to combat this and even spoke to my sons OIC after his second interview to see how much the police were doing to address things like this with schools to warn of the dangers (to both teenage girls and boys)... although it was the girl that had posted these pictures they appeared to be professionally taken at her birthday event (not selfies) so the family must have knowledge of this and this makes it even worse in my opinion..
It is difficult. A lot of social media is of teenagers publishing what are class C images a lot of the time. And many you dont actually know what their age. And its terrifying. This is why its just best to stay away from social media especially with a conviction unless youre just following your friends.
How its delt with is education and hope it reduced and then stops it happening. We had an assembly on sending nudes when I was like 14 (a long time ago). Because someone had sent a nude and well police did get involved and im not sure what happened but the school had to go over the law with the entire school.
How its delt with is education and hope it reduced and then stops it happening. We had an assembly on sending nudes when I was like 14 (a long time ago). Because someone had sent a nude and well police did get involved and im not sure what happened but the school had to go over the law with the entire school.
Just came on here tonight whilst watching BBC, Paul Heaton. Loving the reminiscing of my youth and student days but then so sad at the state of the world our kids are growing up in. "Jennifer, Alison, Phillipa , Sue...I love you from the bottom of my pencil case" such simpler days.
Dear Dad in Limbo and other forum users,
Thank you for posting on the Family and Friends Forum. We appreciate that, given the circumstances, you are understandably trying to make sense of what you have encountered on your son’s Instagram and taking some good safeguarding steps to support him. We just wanted to respond within your thread to clear up some confusion and offer our advice, for you and others to see.
It's clear from your post that you recognise the seriousness of this kind of situation. Our advice, to anyone who comes across concerning images of someone under the age of 18, would be not to save, download, share or otherwise engage with the material. The appropriate action would be to delete the content and unfollow the account, so it is good that your son has done that. We would also encourage you to report this, or any similar content, to the platform itself. If you believe an image may constitute child sexual abuse material, you can also report it to the Internet Watch Foundation, who can assess and take appropriate action.
We understand the concerns about the apparent age of the girl in the image, and her clothing. While the young person appears to have chosen to post this image herself, we know that children and young people may make decisions online without fully understanding the potential risks associated with doing so. The focus should therefore remain on ensuring that any concerning content is not saved, shared or otherwise engaged with, and that appropriate steps are taken to report it where necessary.
The Internet Watch Foundation does not automatically trigger a police investigation of the young person involved, and is a route that can be used alongside, rather than instead of, other appropriate reporting to the platform. Their assessment process is aimed at getting content removed and assessed rather than initiating a criminal investigation. We are not able to confirm what action Instagram itself would take following a report, as this is a decision made by the platform, but reporting is still the recommended step, allowing the platform to review and act on the content. Alternatively, anyone with a concern of this nature can also report it directly to their local police, who can advise on next steps. You would need the precise direct link (URL) of the Instagram post, if possible, to report the content.
We would encourage taking proactive steps to avoid encountering this type of content wherever possible. Instagram has a "Reset suggested content" option (usually found under Settings > Content preferences) which clears what the app has learnt from the user's past activity and lets them start afresh with what Explore, Reels and Feed show them; as part of that process, user’s can also review and unfollow any accounts that they no longer wishes to see content from. They can also mark individual posts as "Not interested" (via the three-dot menu on a post) to reduce similar content appearing in future, and use the platform's reporting tools where appropriate. Taking these steps can help to reduce the likelihood of encountering potentially inappropriate material and reduce the risk of further. For this instance, any engagement that could potentially conflict with any conditions attached to your son's bail. Your son should continue to follow any specific conditions set by the police and seek appropriate legal advice if he is unsure about what any conditions require.
We appreciate that navigating social media and recognising when content may be inappropriate or when someone's age isn't clear, can be genuinely difficult for young people to get right. These are complex issues, and we would always encourage seeking advice if something of concern comes up.
We hope this provides some reassurance and guidance regarding the steps that can be taken. Our Stop It Now advisors are also there to discuss specific situation and answer questions, so do consider contacting the helpline if necessary.
Take care,
The Forum Team
Thank you for posting on the Family and Friends Forum. We appreciate that, given the circumstances, you are understandably trying to make sense of what you have encountered on your son’s Instagram and taking some good safeguarding steps to support him. We just wanted to respond within your thread to clear up some confusion and offer our advice, for you and others to see.
It's clear from your post that you recognise the seriousness of this kind of situation. Our advice, to anyone who comes across concerning images of someone under the age of 18, would be not to save, download, share or otherwise engage with the material. The appropriate action would be to delete the content and unfollow the account, so it is good that your son has done that. We would also encourage you to report this, or any similar content, to the platform itself. If you believe an image may constitute child sexual abuse material, you can also report it to the Internet Watch Foundation, who can assess and take appropriate action.
We understand the concerns about the apparent age of the girl in the image, and her clothing. While the young person appears to have chosen to post this image herself, we know that children and young people may make decisions online without fully understanding the potential risks associated with doing so. The focus should therefore remain on ensuring that any concerning content is not saved, shared or otherwise engaged with, and that appropriate steps are taken to report it where necessary.
The Internet Watch Foundation does not automatically trigger a police investigation of the young person involved, and is a route that can be used alongside, rather than instead of, other appropriate reporting to the platform. Their assessment process is aimed at getting content removed and assessed rather than initiating a criminal investigation. We are not able to confirm what action Instagram itself would take following a report, as this is a decision made by the platform, but reporting is still the recommended step, allowing the platform to review and act on the content. Alternatively, anyone with a concern of this nature can also report it directly to their local police, who can advise on next steps. You would need the precise direct link (URL) of the Instagram post, if possible, to report the content.
We would encourage taking proactive steps to avoid encountering this type of content wherever possible. Instagram has a "Reset suggested content" option (usually found under Settings > Content preferences) which clears what the app has learnt from the user's past activity and lets them start afresh with what Explore, Reels and Feed show them; as part of that process, user’s can also review and unfollow any accounts that they no longer wishes to see content from. They can also mark individual posts as "Not interested" (via the three-dot menu on a post) to reduce similar content appearing in future, and use the platform's reporting tools where appropriate. Taking these steps can help to reduce the likelihood of encountering potentially inappropriate material and reduce the risk of further. For this instance, any engagement that could potentially conflict with any conditions attached to your son's bail. Your son should continue to follow any specific conditions set by the police and seek appropriate legal advice if he is unsure about what any conditions require.
We appreciate that navigating social media and recognising when content may be inappropriate or when someone's age isn't clear, can be genuinely difficult for young people to get right. These are complex issues, and we would always encourage seeking advice if something of concern comes up.
We hope this provides some reassurance and guidance regarding the steps that can be taken. Our Stop It Now advisors are also there to discuss specific situation and answer questions, so do consider contacting the helpline if necessary.
Take care,
The Forum Team
