Supervised contact in public
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My husband was arrested for iioc in mid March which like all of us here came as a massive shock. I have chosen to separate, but we have 18 years behind us and I cannot guarantee what will happen between us after the devices come back. He hasn't seen our kids in person since the arrest. He has been having FaceTime twice a week since mid April. The kids keep on asking when they can see him properly. They are missing him. They are 10 and 14.
They are on a CIN plan and the second core meeting is due next week, but I haven't even heard from the social worker since the (first) meeting 6 weeks ago. In the notes for that meeting it says that following successful video calls, the next step would be supervised face to face contact - but not with 'mum' as the supervisor. There's no expansion on this, no suggestions of how that contact should happen, or who should supervise, or why I'm not suitable to supervise.
I have been cooperative with the SW, not done anything without clearance from her, I've run everything by her and fully understand that there is now a risk of harm to my children that I was unaware of before.
When I next see her (whether that's before the meeting, or at the meeting) I want to propose that we start to meet up in a public place with me supervising. Something like an hour or two every Saturday. Realistically, what would happen if she refused and said it had to be a contact centre? (I will not allow a contact centre for various reasons)
I'm not going to go against what SW says (apart from not allowing a contact centre), but really if I did just say "I'm taking the kids to meet their dad in a public place for an hour every Saturday and deem myself fit to supervise", what will they do? Step up to a CPP? Which in practice just means more frequent visits and meetings, right? Or literally come and take them away? I wouldn't actually do it without their clearance of course, but they really want to see their dad and their mental health is suffering. It is in their best interests to slowly start seeing their dad again, in a safe and controlled way, and I want to prepare myself for her possible reasons why she doesn't deem that I can supervise...?
Does anyone else have any similar experiences? X
They are on a CIN plan and the second core meeting is due next week, but I haven't even heard from the social worker since the (first) meeting 6 weeks ago. In the notes for that meeting it says that following successful video calls, the next step would be supervised face to face contact - but not with 'mum' as the supervisor. There's no expansion on this, no suggestions of how that contact should happen, or who should supervise, or why I'm not suitable to supervise.
I have been cooperative with the SW, not done anything without clearance from her, I've run everything by her and fully understand that there is now a risk of harm to my children that I was unaware of before.
When I next see her (whether that's before the meeting, or at the meeting) I want to propose that we start to meet up in a public place with me supervising. Something like an hour or two every Saturday. Realistically, what would happen if she refused and said it had to be a contact centre? (I will not allow a contact centre for various reasons)
I'm not going to go against what SW says (apart from not allowing a contact centre), but really if I did just say "I'm taking the kids to meet their dad in a public place for an hour every Saturday and deem myself fit to supervise", what will they do? Step up to a CPP? Which in practice just means more frequent visits and meetings, right? Or literally come and take them away? I wouldn't actually do it without their clearance of course, but they really want to see their dad and their mental health is suffering. It is in their best interests to slowly start seeing their dad again, in a safe and controlled way, and I want to prepare myself for her possible reasons why she doesn't deem that I can supervise...?
Does anyone else have any similar experiences? X
Lemondrizzlecake
I would absolutely be talking to the s/w before next meeting or maybe email would be better for a paper trail.
You have obviously fully co-operated with them and want to know why you are unable to supervise and for what reason.
If your children are on the cin they can't up it unless you do something wrong. Your children are old enough to make up there own minds so I'd be saying this is the meeting .. children's mental health is top priority.
Wishing you all the best x
I would absolutely be talking to the s/w before next meeting or maybe email would be better for a paper trail.
You have obviously fully co-operated with them and want to know why you are unable to supervise and for what reason.
If your children are on the cin they can't up it unless you do something wrong. Your children are old enough to make up there own minds so I'd be saying this is the meeting .. children's mental health is top priority.
Wishing you all the best x
Hi LemonDrizzleCake,
I have a very similar experience!
So my partner was of course arrested for a similar offence.
He had 28days police bail which said no contact with children under 18 including his own.
Bail up and finished, case handed to children's services.
They didn't let them have any contact with there dad for a further 3 weeks
Then said contact at grandparents house and supervised by my parents. I didn't question it as I was so happy for my children.
Then I pushed at the first CIN for contact out in the community as our 3yr old was climbing the walls stuck in a front room and the weather was lovely. By this time the children had been with there dad at my parents 5 times. This was agreed but still said only supervised by grandparents. I was annoyed that they wouldn't let me supervise but again I was pleased they'd said yes to contact outside to stayed quiet.
After reading and re reading the report and it saying can not be supervised by mother and continuing to access her protective capacity I decided I wanted to find out more, why I couldn't supervise, how they were accessing me and what they wanted me to do to get to the point of me supervising.
I sent 2 emails politely but blantly asking why I'm not protective and what my next steps where to prove I was. If they wanted me to do a course or an assessment. Didn't get an answer just a vague reply. Then spoke on the phone and again more or less no answer.
5 month later my children were desperate for more time with there dad and I was hugely fed up of watching them suffer and getting no explanation... It seemed like they didn't have a reason.
So after speaking to some of these ladies, calling the family rights group and since all the social worker kept saying is we would have to seek legal advice if you don't follow our advice I sourt legal advice myself.
The result is I was helped to feel empowered by the ladies on this forum, the family rights group reminded me a CIN is voluntary and a CPP is voluntary and that both are to support the parent by giving ADVICE not orders and the solicitor told me that childrens services would have to take me to court and prove my children are at risk of significant harm if I supervise... SIGNIFICANT harm not just harm.
So with the help of the ladies and the family rights group I wrote a safety plan of my own to cover safeguarding my children whilst I supervise. Covering all the things children's services could worry about...e.g. What happens if mum needs to toilet and leave the children with the dad ( if mum leaves for the toilet or any other reason the children will follow and stay within sight and hearing) what if the dad takes photos of the children (mum take phone throughout contact) and so on...
So at the last CIN meeting I made my voice heard and told everyone my children's metal health is being extremely undervalued, that I can physically safeguard them but no one is helping me safeguard their mental health so I need to act for them and that I have sought legal advice myself and going forward I will be supervising and that I will be sending my safety plan to everyone. I now supervise and although the social worker at the time told me she'd have to speak to her manager I haven't heard from her in terms of her opinion and started supervising that following weekend. The SW came to see the kids last week and didn't say anything to me.
My advice to you is you know what is best for your children. You are a protective parent. To call the family rights group and learn your rights and if you want contact a family law solicitor and do a free over the phone consultation. You have said you've left your partner, this normally seems to make ss very happy so I'm surprised they're being so tough on you. I would'nt put a restriction on yourself to say just 1hr every Saturday as then you'll have to fight to change this if you want to in the future. Instead that you'll supervised at the weekends to allow time so desperatly needed for you childrens mental health. Look into doing a safety plan yourself. Call the StopItNow helpline for advice about what you could do to gain more knowledge about recognising abuse as this will be good to ease SS worries.
Most importantly you are their mum, you have rights, you are protective and you're doing amazing!!!!
I hope that made some sense and it helps. If it didn't ask me what I mean as that was some very passionate typing and may have gone a bit blurry for someone else trying to understand. xxx
I have a very similar experience!
So my partner was of course arrested for a similar offence.
He had 28days police bail which said no contact with children under 18 including his own.
Bail up and finished, case handed to children's services.
They didn't let them have any contact with there dad for a further 3 weeks
Then said contact at grandparents house and supervised by my parents. I didn't question it as I was so happy for my children.
Then I pushed at the first CIN for contact out in the community as our 3yr old was climbing the walls stuck in a front room and the weather was lovely. By this time the children had been with there dad at my parents 5 times. This was agreed but still said only supervised by grandparents. I was annoyed that they wouldn't let me supervise but again I was pleased they'd said yes to contact outside to stayed quiet.
After reading and re reading the report and it saying can not be supervised by mother and continuing to access her protective capacity I decided I wanted to find out more, why I couldn't supervise, how they were accessing me and what they wanted me to do to get to the point of me supervising.
I sent 2 emails politely but blantly asking why I'm not protective and what my next steps where to prove I was. If they wanted me to do a course or an assessment. Didn't get an answer just a vague reply. Then spoke on the phone and again more or less no answer.
5 month later my children were desperate for more time with there dad and I was hugely fed up of watching them suffer and getting no explanation... It seemed like they didn't have a reason.
So after speaking to some of these ladies, calling the family rights group and since all the social worker kept saying is we would have to seek legal advice if you don't follow our advice I sourt legal advice myself.
The result is I was helped to feel empowered by the ladies on this forum, the family rights group reminded me a CIN is voluntary and a CPP is voluntary and that both are to support the parent by giving ADVICE not orders and the solicitor told me that childrens services would have to take me to court and prove my children are at risk of significant harm if I supervise... SIGNIFICANT harm not just harm.
So with the help of the ladies and the family rights group I wrote a safety plan of my own to cover safeguarding my children whilst I supervise. Covering all the things children's services could worry about...e.g. What happens if mum needs to toilet and leave the children with the dad ( if mum leaves for the toilet or any other reason the children will follow and stay within sight and hearing) what if the dad takes photos of the children (mum take phone throughout contact) and so on...
So at the last CIN meeting I made my voice heard and told everyone my children's metal health is being extremely undervalued, that I can physically safeguard them but no one is helping me safeguard their mental health so I need to act for them and that I have sought legal advice myself and going forward I will be supervising and that I will be sending my safety plan to everyone. I now supervise and although the social worker at the time told me she'd have to speak to her manager I haven't heard from her in terms of her opinion and started supervising that following weekend. The SW came to see the kids last week and didn't say anything to me.
My advice to you is you know what is best for your children. You are a protective parent. To call the family rights group and learn your rights and if you want contact a family law solicitor and do a free over the phone consultation. You have said you've left your partner, this normally seems to make ss very happy so I'm surprised they're being so tough on you. I would'nt put a restriction on yourself to say just 1hr every Saturday as then you'll have to fight to change this if you want to in the future. Instead that you'll supervised at the weekends to allow time so desperatly needed for you childrens mental health. Look into doing a safety plan yourself. Call the StopItNow helpline for advice about what you could do to gain more knowledge about recognising abuse as this will be good to ease SS worries.
Most importantly you are their mum, you have rights, you are protective and you're doing amazing!!!!
I hope that made some sense and it helps. If it didn't ask me what I mean as that was some very passionate typing and may have gone a bit blurry for someone else trying to understand. xxx
Thank you both so much,
Becky1234, you're right I need to get something down in writing before the meeting, thank you for taking the time to reply x
SadAndWorried, thank you, that was so helpful and really made sense. Realistically I know that I'm a good mum, I know that only a judge can remove my children, and I know that I absolutely have their best interests at heart! I just don't want to cause any waves with those in authority of course, but I'm learning the hard way that perhaps SS take the easy route where they see someone like me just blindly doing what they're told out of that 'fear' for authority! I had started to write a safety plan but you've inspired me to polish it up and properly stand up for what's best for my children, because it feels like to SS they are merely just a case number right now! :( x
Becky1234, you're right I need to get something down in writing before the meeting, thank you for taking the time to reply x
SadAndWorried, thank you, that was so helpful and really made sense. Realistically I know that I'm a good mum, I know that only a judge can remove my children, and I know that I absolutely have their best interests at heart! I just don't want to cause any waves with those in authority of course, but I'm learning the hard way that perhaps SS take the easy route where they see someone like me just blindly doing what they're told out of that 'fear' for authority! I had started to write a safety plan but you've inspired me to polish it up and properly stand up for what's best for my children, because it feels like to SS they are merely just a case number right now! :( x
I'm pleased it made sense and has given you a boost of confidence hun. From what others have told me and from what I've experienced myself it seems the more we just accepted and follow whatever they say the harder it is on our children. I was exactly the same though and still am from time to time...I do go in and out of feeling powerful and panicked when it comes to social services. I wanted to say yes to everything the social worker said and I did because I was so so afraid of their power but I unfortunately felt the same as you, we were just another case and all they want to do is make their cases as easy as possible. So if we say yes to everything then the SW hasn't got much to do so it's one case that turns a little lighter. They just don't seem to see that safeguarding isn't just about the children physically or at least my SW can't understand it. I just think at least I'll have little or no regrets if I give it my best go at improving things for the children. Also how can a mother fighting for their children to get the best outcome be a negative. Do your children's schools attend the CIN ? xx
how do you call the family rights group? if you dont mind me asking
Dawn14
0808 801 0366 this is the family rights group phone number it's also on Google its free and confidential hope it helps you x
0808 801 0366 this is the family rights group phone number it's also on Google its free and confidential hope it helps you x
I had a similar situation it was five weeks that my child hadn't seen their father so I started calling the SW daily leaving messages that my child was distressed and wanted to see their father when she got back to me she apologised and said she'd been on holiday I was under the impression I had to get somebody else to supervise but after having a face-to-face with the SW she said that was absolutely fine for me to do it. So hang in there until you have the face-to-face and then you'll be able to make a better decision.
Hi Becky 1234,
thank you so much for that sorry late replying but im new to the forum and i dont get notifcation when someone replies
xxxx
thank you so much for that sorry late replying but im new to the forum and i dont get notifcation when someone replies
xxxx
So it transpires that the SW has falsified 2 visits to me/my children! :(
As I mentioned in my OP, I hadn't seen her in about 6 weeks and the CIN meeting was imminent. Well, the CIN meeting was cancelled with less than 24 hours notice, and rescheduled for 2 weeks later (a few days from now). I immediately emailed with a copy of the safety plan I'd written for moving forward with contact - progressing from video calls to contact in public, explaining that I was going to raise it at the meeting but since it had now been cancelled and I hadn't seen the SW in ages, I was raising it now by email. She then visited us a few days later, said that the plan I'd written looked good and that we could definitely discuss it as part of the CIN plan/meeting going forward.
Anyway, after this I received a call from CS doing a random satisfaction survey and I commented about the long gap in visits. I then had a call from a manager asking me to confirm specific dates etc, and it turns out that two of the dates the SW claims to have visited us... she didn't!
Our rescheduled CIN meeting is supposed to be in a few days, the kids really want to see their dad in person, and I really don't know what to do with this information, or what I should be doing, if anything?! Not seeing us for 6/7 weeks I'm not really bothered by, but lying about visits just seems quite shocking to me...?!
As I mentioned in my OP, I hadn't seen her in about 6 weeks and the CIN meeting was imminent. Well, the CIN meeting was cancelled with less than 24 hours notice, and rescheduled for 2 weeks later (a few days from now). I immediately emailed with a copy of the safety plan I'd written for moving forward with contact - progressing from video calls to contact in public, explaining that I was going to raise it at the meeting but since it had now been cancelled and I hadn't seen the SW in ages, I was raising it now by email. She then visited us a few days later, said that the plan I'd written looked good and that we could definitely discuss it as part of the CIN plan/meeting going forward.
Anyway, after this I received a call from CS doing a random satisfaction survey and I commented about the long gap in visits. I then had a call from a manager asking me to confirm specific dates etc, and it turns out that two of the dates the SW claims to have visited us... she didn't!
Our rescheduled CIN meeting is supposed to be in a few days, the kids really want to see their dad in person, and I really don't know what to do with this information, or what I should be doing, if anything?! Not seeing us for 6/7 weeks I'm not really bothered by, but lying about visits just seems quite shocking to me...?!
That is shocking.... and if you were found to be lying to SS they would come down to you like a ton of bricks. I'm afraid I would be requesting a new SW. I would email her manager requesting that the meeting goes ahead but that you would like a new SW as you feel that you can no longer trust someone who has falsely claimed to have visited you when she didn't (& emphasise how you would gave really appreciated some support during this difficult time) This is really unacceptable and I suspect you may not be the only one who she has made up visits for. The manager should be looking into this too.
LemonDrizzleCake
That is absolutely unacceptable! You have the right to request a new social worker and I would 100% ask for a new one. Your SW has a huge impact on the outcome for your family and your children and with such a delicate and complex case you absolutely need someone that is on the ball with visits, support and paperwork. Falsifying that she'd visited you is unacceptable! After all contact, in person or over the phone SW need to write it up and log what happen, so what on earth has she written about those 'visits' She is a professional there to safeguard children and families and she is not doing that. I think I said if above but contact the family rights group for advice.
Personally I would be writing a formal complaint, asking for a new social worker and I'd ask that she is not at the CIN!
I don't doubt that you'll get a new SW, I'd imagine given what the SW has done by lieing that the manager wouldn't expect anything less than a formal complaint from a mother trying to protect her children and tbh I'd hope that the SW would be removed from the CIN and your case without you asking.
I know those things might be overwhelming to read and do but you need to make sure the SW does this correctly and works with you or you'll struggle so much to get what you want from children's services and these meeting. I'd be including in your email that you've lost two key things that will ensure your children are safeguarded with the support of children's services and that is trust and transparency with your social worker. Frg have a complaint template.
Have some short notes written down that you want to discuss at the CIN. This helps me to feel more prepared and less lost when they go to me and ask how myself and the children are. If they start to discuss what's happened with the lying, personally id say thank you for being it up but that you'd like to discuss that matter separately and focus the meeting on your children.
The children seeing there dad in person. Ask at the meeting the reasons why they can't and then ask what children's services plans are to improve this as it is damaging your children's mental health. Suggest you're happy to do any course they recommend so you can gain more knowledge and for the sake of your children.
Deep breaths Hun! You're doing amazing!
That is absolutely unacceptable! You have the right to request a new social worker and I would 100% ask for a new one. Your SW has a huge impact on the outcome for your family and your children and with such a delicate and complex case you absolutely need someone that is on the ball with visits, support and paperwork. Falsifying that she'd visited you is unacceptable! After all contact, in person or over the phone SW need to write it up and log what happen, so what on earth has she written about those 'visits' She is a professional there to safeguard children and families and she is not doing that. I think I said if above but contact the family rights group for advice.
Personally I would be writing a formal complaint, asking for a new social worker and I'd ask that she is not at the CIN!
I don't doubt that you'll get a new SW, I'd imagine given what the SW has done by lieing that the manager wouldn't expect anything less than a formal complaint from a mother trying to protect her children and tbh I'd hope that the SW would be removed from the CIN and your case without you asking.
I know those things might be overwhelming to read and do but you need to make sure the SW does this correctly and works with you or you'll struggle so much to get what you want from children's services and these meeting. I'd be including in your email that you've lost two key things that will ensure your children are safeguarded with the support of children's services and that is trust and transparency with your social worker. Frg have a complaint template.
Have some short notes written down that you want to discuss at the CIN. This helps me to feel more prepared and less lost when they go to me and ask how myself and the children are. If they start to discuss what's happened with the lying, personally id say thank you for being it up but that you'd like to discuss that matter separately and focus the meeting on your children.
The children seeing there dad in person. Ask at the meeting the reasons why they can't and then ask what children's services plans are to improve this as it is damaging your children's mental health. Suggest you're happy to do any course they recommend so you can gain more knowledge and for the sake of your children.
Deep breaths Hun! You're doing amazing!
Thank you both. The manager contacted me today to say that we've been assigned a new SW and they're doing a formal investigation into the faked visits. Due to this, the CIN meeting has been cancelled again, but she is going to call me tomorrow to go over what I had originally wanted to talk about which was contact with dad in public. So now instead of a CIN meeting, it's just me and the manager having a chat - I don't know if that's better or worse! My adrenaline levels seem to sky rocket whenever I have to speak to children's services so I'll make sure I have a copy of my plan in front of me when she calls and hopefully that will help a bit!
That's great that you don't need to push for a new social worker and that it's being taken seriously. I've said to my social worker that I'd prefer to do most via email because it's so emotive for me and I often come away from a phone call either not sure on what's been said or forgotten to say something, maybe ask for a follow up email for clarification then you can use that to bring anything up afterwards. I'd say it could go in your favour, they always say they need to talk to their manager first so you've cut out the middle man. Try and use the adrenaline in your favour... I bet you've surprised yourself alot since this begun at how strong you are... You've got this!! XXX
That's brilliant news! I'm not surprised there is an investigation going on. Faking visits is a definite misconduct issue.
I agree that speaking to the manager is actually better - our awful SW always had to run everything past her manager so at least yiu won't have to deal with any of that nonsense. Good luck!!
I agree that speaking to the manager is actually better - our awful SW always had to run everything past her manager so at least yiu won't have to deal with any of that nonsense. Good luck!!