Initial search on the day
Notifications OFF
Hi all. Racking our brains about this one. On the day of the search the police ran devices like USBs through a search on a big chunky laptop they had brought with them. Nothing showed up and partner wasn't arrested, but they took phone and laptop.
My question is, surely they would have ran laptop and phone through the same initial search? We just can't remember if they did or not.
For example, let's say they fail to initially check a laptop or phone on a search and there is obvious evidence of the current abuse of a child on there. And the police took it but didn't get round to looking for months on end, during which time some poor child is suffering. Surely this would be terrible practice and the police would be in trouble for not doing anything sooner?
So it seems logical to us that they would have done some sort of initial check, which didn't show anything up as he wasn't arrested or questioned. But at the end of the day we don't know. It just seems logical they would have done this, to cover their own backs in case there had been obvious evidence of horrific things that they should have picked up sooner?
On the day of the knock we were just so traumatised neither of us can remember. We know they checked USBs because they left them with us afterwards, but can anyone shine a light on the process and what was likely to have happened??
My question is, surely they would have ran laptop and phone through the same initial search? We just can't remember if they did or not.
For example, let's say they fail to initially check a laptop or phone on a search and there is obvious evidence of the current abuse of a child on there. And the police took it but didn't get round to looking for months on end, during which time some poor child is suffering. Surely this would be terrible practice and the police would be in trouble for not doing anything sooner?
So it seems logical to us that they would have done some sort of initial check, which didn't show anything up as he wasn't arrested or questioned. But at the end of the day we don't know. It just seems logical they would have done this, to cover their own backs in case there had been obvious evidence of horrific things that they should have picked up sooner?
On the day of the knock we were just so traumatised neither of us can remember. We know they checked USBs because they left them with us afterwards, but can anyone shine a light on the process and what was likely to have happened??
All forces work slightly differently. They will have had some evidence regarding an offence prior to coming to your house so it will depend what evidence that is. If they had any concerns about the welfare of a child that would be acted upon, if you have child an immediate referal would be to social services. They cannot guess what he has been up to or likely to be involved with, so if they do not have any evidence to suggest a child is in danger they won't know to act on it. However if you know what a child is in danger then you should inform them or social services. If he wasn't arrested maybe they don't have enough evidence. It is very confusing and it really is a shock when tgey come, I couldn't even remember what they had taken on the day.
When the knock came to us the same thing happened. I assumed it was because the usb's were simply a storage device and not capable of downloading stuff. I'm not a techie but they took computers and phone's and found stuff on an old laptop that was stashed away and forgotten about. My phone was returned to me months later (though it no longer worked). There was no initial arrest we were both under investigation. Once material was found I was told that I was no longer under investigation. This was about December 2017 and he was not charged until Monday just gone. There does not seem to be any set course as to how these things go or has to how long it takes.
Hi Headmashed. Thank you for the reply.
So what were your timescales? Search in December 2017? When did they tell you they'd found things? When was his interview? And then it took them till now to make a charging decision? Wow. Feel for you.
So what were your timescales? Search in December 2017? When did they tell you they'd found things? When was his interview? And then it took them till now to make a charging decision? Wow. Feel for you.
The knock was August 2017, first interview was December 2017 when they informed his employer and he was suspended from work. This was his first suicide attempt. We heard nothing then until October 2018. He was charged on 1st April 2019. It made us believe that maybe there wasn't going to be any charges and we were picking pieces up and slowly putting them back together only for it all to come crashing down again after another attempt at suicide from him.
Hi Headmashed. Sorry to ask so many questions! Head just going round in circles!
So he was not arrested during the knock? And what was the charge finally? What category of images?
Had he been honest with you or has the charge revealed things you didn't know?
Sorry to ask, just desperate to hear other's stories.
So he was not arrested during the knock? And what was the charge finally? What category of images?
Had he been honest with you or has the charge revealed things you didn't know?
Sorry to ask, just desperate to hear other's stories.
No, he wasn't arrested at the initial knock and the police told us we were both under investigation. He was adamant that they would find nothing. The arrest only came when he was charged last week. The charge sheet states making (which is having them on your device) 35 cat a images, 70 cat be and 200 cat c. It's not looking good for him.
So sorry to hear that. Sounds like he has a lot of work and healing to do to work through the reasons he did it and to fully face up to himself. I'm so sorry you're going through it. Stay strong. You're right, it's not great but get good legal representation. As horrible as it sounds, from what I've read that's not a huge amount of images, relatively. Some men have thousands and still rebuild a life. There will always be hope, even when it doesn't feel like it and you can't connect to it.
Hello Headmashed,
can I offer some advice?
Make sure any computer evidence is checked by an independent forensic computer expert. Any images found could possibly be challenged on how they got there and if there is was any intent. Many will be located in parts of the computer that without specialist programmes cannot be accessed by the normal user and maybe contain no actual data that shows illegal activity.
There may also be an opportunity to challenge the age of the individuals in the images. It’s only the judge or jury who can finally determine this so bear that in mind.
Im not saying this because
a) I have any legal qualifications.
b) I have any computer knowledge.
c) I want to defend the guilty.
d) I want anyone to ‘get off’ charges.
I simply believe in justice and truth.
Jaded
can I offer some advice?
Make sure any computer evidence is checked by an independent forensic computer expert. Any images found could possibly be challenged on how they got there and if there is was any intent. Many will be located in parts of the computer that without specialist programmes cannot be accessed by the normal user and maybe contain no actual data that shows illegal activity.
There may also be an opportunity to challenge the age of the individuals in the images. It’s only the judge or jury who can finally determine this so bear that in mind.
Im not saying this because
a) I have any legal qualifications.
b) I have any computer knowledge.
c) I want to defend the guilty.
d) I want anyone to ‘get off’ charges.
I simply believe in justice and truth.
Jaded
Christina - I think they all do it differently across the different police forces. There was a recent report on the Met Police and how bad they are at this - you can google it. None of our devices were checked on day. But I asked if I could keep my iPad and as they didn’t suspect me they just looked at my browsing history in front of me and then gave me it back. Then my sons stuff was returned v quickly - think they did same with his stuff. And then returned some other stuff recently - know they can’t have even checked one of the things as they had no way of getting into it and didn’t even ask us how to. I think they get so much stuff from the search they can’t possibly look at it all. At interview they see if the person can tell them what devices they usually use and then prioritise them.
Yes I do think they just leave things and awful images could be on there.
Yes I do think they just leave things and awful images could be on there.
Hi
On the day of the knock they had a look at my mobile then have it back, his work laptop and phone were returned after 3 weeks but the other stuff took 3 months which I now know is really quick!
After he'd pleaded not guilty at crown court the judge told the prosecution to go back to the electrical items and re-look at them. They had obviously not looked at everything because on one particular item they found a further 391 Cat A images and numerous sites that he had visited.
The doors need to be a uniformity around this but as we know there isn't and the length of time waiting about just kills you!
Xx
On the day of the knock they had a look at my mobile then have it back, his work laptop and phone were returned after 3 weeks but the other stuff took 3 months which I now know is really quick!
After he'd pleaded not guilty at crown court the judge told the prosecution to go back to the electrical items and re-look at them. They had obviously not looked at everything because on one particular item they found a further 391 Cat A images and numerous sites that he had visited.
The doors need to be a uniformity around this but as we know there isn't and the length of time waiting about just kills you!
Xx
Hi Tracey. Can I ask roughly what area you are in?
In a couple of weeks we will be at 3 month point, with absolutely nothing from the police since they left us on the morning of the knock, other than a brief update to say they are still looking at his phone. We have young children close to us in family and husbands job involves young people, and while he has been suspended pending the police investigation outcome, the police have said nothing else either to his place of work, or our extended family.
Husband is adamant there is nothing there but things are still crumbling in terms of our lives every day the wait goes on. It's not even like life is on hold. "On hold" would be bearable. It's stagnant, dead, decaying while we wait.
I have to be honest and say even though I love him, I'll be a lot happier if and when the police confirm what he says. But at the same time, the police are doing a really unprofessional job. If they're worried enough to turn our house and lives upside down, why haven't they followed anything up? Why are they leaving him to do as he wants? Why didn't they take control of his email, or social media, or ask for any of those passwords?!
I just think the whole thing is a farce. Everyone from courts to police are in denial about the scale and causes of this problem. I think it's got a lot in common with the war on drugs. It doesn't work. You have to look at the societal reasons that this is happening and men are getting sucked in. Treating everyone like a pedophile is not rational. The term even annoys me, now that I've done more reading. The police unit is called the Pedophile Online Investigation Team. But a pedophile is someone into pre-pubescent children, and some men caught with this kind of thing may have looked at 17 year old girls in swimwear! It just seems wrong that they are lumped in with men who have looked at tiny kids. Sorry, I feel like I'm just ranting now. I just think that in 10 years we will have a very different way of seeing this and a very different approach, hopefully. But then sometimes I think I'm mad and being too sane and I should be more hysterical. I can't win.
Just want some answers, and just want this over. :(
In a couple of weeks we will be at 3 month point, with absolutely nothing from the police since they left us on the morning of the knock, other than a brief update to say they are still looking at his phone. We have young children close to us in family and husbands job involves young people, and while he has been suspended pending the police investigation outcome, the police have said nothing else either to his place of work, or our extended family.
Husband is adamant there is nothing there but things are still crumbling in terms of our lives every day the wait goes on. It's not even like life is on hold. "On hold" would be bearable. It's stagnant, dead, decaying while we wait.
I have to be honest and say even though I love him, I'll be a lot happier if and when the police confirm what he says. But at the same time, the police are doing a really unprofessional job. If they're worried enough to turn our house and lives upside down, why haven't they followed anything up? Why are they leaving him to do as he wants? Why didn't they take control of his email, or social media, or ask for any of those passwords?!
I just think the whole thing is a farce. Everyone from courts to police are in denial about the scale and causes of this problem. I think it's got a lot in common with the war on drugs. It doesn't work. You have to look at the societal reasons that this is happening and men are getting sucked in. Treating everyone like a pedophile is not rational. The term even annoys me, now that I've done more reading. The police unit is called the Pedophile Online Investigation Team. But a pedophile is someone into pre-pubescent children, and some men caught with this kind of thing may have looked at 17 year old girls in swimwear! It just seems wrong that they are lumped in with men who have looked at tiny kids. Sorry, I feel like I'm just ranting now. I just think that in 10 years we will have a very different way of seeing this and a very different approach, hopefully. But then sometimes I think I'm mad and being too sane and I should be more hysterical. I can't win.
Just want some answers, and just want this over. :(
Christina - me too. Knock in December and still nothing. Police told us other week for first time that they haven’t started yet. One device gone to high tech unit, 2 others in triage or something. Other stuff been returned and they haven’t looked at it.
in the middle of it all got the insanity of social services.
thinking I may be in same area as you as the unit my partner with is called the same as yours - or are they all called that ?
in the middle of it all got the insanity of social services.
thinking I may be in same area as you as the unit my partner with is called the same as yours - or are they all called that ?
17 year olds in swim wear wouldn’t be indecent though would it? Therefore not illegal ?
Hallelujah, someone who’s asking the same questions as me. Once you’re caught up in this there’s no going back. Yes pictures of 17 year olds or images where they can’t officially age the person in the photo will be classed as indecent if the police say so. Then lumped together with men who have horrific sexual abuse images of babies. How can that be right? The term ‘paedophile’ is bandied around by all and sundry rather than the most serious label you can apply to someone be part of a psychological assessment of diagnosis. Be careful, you’ll be called a paedo lover if you’re not careful! When is someone going to take a calm, rationale approach to all this? Not ever I don’t think, there is too much investment in this type of offending to take a step back and ask these serious questions. Too much to say to be honest and no one wants to hear it. I believe one day though it will all come out, truth will prevail.
Hi Jaded - will they seriously say pictures of clothed teenagers are indecent?
Yes they can. Category C could include anything from naked pictures of toddlers to selfies of 17 year old girls in underwear or swimwear.
I've learnt that The Sun newspaper only raised the age limit for it's Page 3 models to 18 in 2003. Up till then they had girls 16 or above! Men are being labelled pedophiles and having lives ruined nowadays for looking at stuff that was in the most popular national newspaper till 2003!!
As much as I'm angry at him for getting us in this mess, I just can't believe how mad this whole thing is. Obviously if he has done worse, it'd be different. But what I've said above is all true.
It's a consequence of all of us not wanting to face this problem as a society that we have such a lack of sense around all of it. ABSOLUTELY the first instinct should be to protect kids. But if men are silly and weak but the worst they have looked at is clothed pictures of developed teenage girls, why are they treated like men looking at naked photos of little ones?? Sorry, I've just learned so much and it is just crazy. Feel like I'm going insane.
Am I being too nice to these men???!!!
I've learnt that The Sun newspaper only raised the age limit for it's Page 3 models to 18 in 2003. Up till then they had girls 16 or above! Men are being labelled pedophiles and having lives ruined nowadays for looking at stuff that was in the most popular national newspaper till 2003!!
As much as I'm angry at him for getting us in this mess, I just can't believe how mad this whole thing is. Obviously if he has done worse, it'd be different. But what I've said above is all true.
It's a consequence of all of us not wanting to face this problem as a society that we have such a lack of sense around all of it. ABSOLUTELY the first instinct should be to protect kids. But if men are silly and weak but the worst they have looked at is clothed pictures of developed teenage girls, why are they treated like men looking at naked photos of little ones?? Sorry, I've just learned so much and it is just crazy. Feel like I'm going insane.
Am I being too nice to these men???!!!
Hi Christina - I don’t know that I would say too nice but you and so many here are far more compassionate towards your partners than I feel. I know my adult children feel I am too hard on him but after having confrontations with him due to his use of porn a few years back the age of the children feels almost irrelevant. However young or old they were it was a continued betrayal in our relationship addded to by it being illegal. Sometimes I think I have it all out of proportion but he knew that what he was doing would hurt me and I just cannot get past that. Sorry for this rambling post. X