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My person is my brother in law and he was caught following vigilantes knocking on his door 18 months ago. Hes not yet been charged, and is still waiting for the devices to be analysed, he was due back with the police a couple of weeks ago but this has been extended by another 6 months, which will take him to over 2 years since his arrest. I think this isnt uncommon from what I've read. He originally had bail conditions, but those have now expired. He has always had a tendency to minimise what he did 'I would never harm a child' etc and has said he just 'craved company and has no sexual interest in children' (so why he was having sexual communication with someone he thought was a 14 year old girl is anyones guess).
The problem I have now though is that the story keeps changing,
First it was 'an innocent chat with a person online'. Then, it turns out that the person was a 'young girl' (obviosuly a decoy). Then he had arranged to meet 'her'.
Then, it was 'there were a couple of Cat C images' on the phone', then 'a few pictures that I'd 'forgotten about'... you get the idea.
Each time he says Ive been honest with you... but then more comes out.
The most recent thing was that he had 'thousands of people adding him as a friend' on social media, and then that he talked to 'maybe 30 or 40 of them' of whom a few 'might have been real children'. But of course, he has no sexual interest in children. He just wants company. God knows what the reality of the situation is and I suspect he probably doesnt remember half of it himself as he has issues with substance misuse as well. He also has neurodiversity.
I have really tried to support him, but this drip drip drip of information coming out is really hard to deal with. It makes it very difficult to know how to support him, which I am trying to do - his immediate family arent - but also impossible for me to make a risk assessment for him being around my own children (who are young teenagers). He hasnt seen them, or indeed us, since his arrest but has asked to do so. I'm not going to allow this for now, if at all.
I know its probably not uncommon for people to do it like this but its so hard. How have others managed this?
The problem I have now though is that the story keeps changing,
First it was 'an innocent chat with a person online'. Then, it turns out that the person was a 'young girl' (obviosuly a decoy). Then he had arranged to meet 'her'.
Then, it was 'there were a couple of Cat C images' on the phone', then 'a few pictures that I'd 'forgotten about'... you get the idea.
Each time he says Ive been honest with you... but then more comes out.
The most recent thing was that he had 'thousands of people adding him as a friend' on social media, and then that he talked to 'maybe 30 or 40 of them' of whom a few 'might have been real children'. But of course, he has no sexual interest in children. He just wants company. God knows what the reality of the situation is and I suspect he probably doesnt remember half of it himself as he has issues with substance misuse as well. He also has neurodiversity.
I have really tried to support him, but this drip drip drip of information coming out is really hard to deal with. It makes it very difficult to know how to support him, which I am trying to do - his immediate family arent - but also impossible for me to make a risk assessment for him being around my own children (who are young teenagers). He hasnt seen them, or indeed us, since his arrest but has asked to do so. I'm not going to allow this for now, if at all.
I know its probably not uncommon for people to do it like this but its so hard. How have others managed this?
Hi,
it's definitely not uncommon for all the reasons you stated around neurodivergence, substance misuse etc. I also feel there is an element of them trying to protect both themselves and their loved ones by minimising.
This may sound blunt so I apologise in advance, I don't mean it in a judgmental way at all I've just struggled to find the words. I'm now at a point where all of it is child abuse and none of us on here will ever condone the actions of our person who offended. If I were in your position with a brother in law, knowing what I know now I'd make the same decisions for my children as I have with my partner. A safety plan of no unsupervised contact and a lot of educating my children on how to keep themselves safe.
If your children have had no contact for 2 years what impact has it had on their life? Do they want contact? Do they know about his offending?
Has your brother in law engaged with any of the charities that can support him in understanding his behaviour or is he in complete denial? This is what I would consider to be the most important factor in making a decision around your relationship with him going forward. It's not an easy journey at all but it's necessary for him to address it and for you to see the work he is doing on himself.
Whether you cut contact, support or support from a distance you have still been through trauma so perhaps seeking some help for yourself and potentially doing the inform course through lff might be of benefit to you.
You're not alone in this journey, keep reaching out. Love and strength xxx
it's definitely not uncommon for all the reasons you stated around neurodivergence, substance misuse etc. I also feel there is an element of them trying to protect both themselves and their loved ones by minimising.
This may sound blunt so I apologise in advance, I don't mean it in a judgmental way at all I've just struggled to find the words. I'm now at a point where all of it is child abuse and none of us on here will ever condone the actions of our person who offended. If I were in your position with a brother in law, knowing what I know now I'd make the same decisions for my children as I have with my partner. A safety plan of no unsupervised contact and a lot of educating my children on how to keep themselves safe.
If your children have had no contact for 2 years what impact has it had on their life? Do they want contact? Do they know about his offending?
Has your brother in law engaged with any of the charities that can support him in understanding his behaviour or is he in complete denial? This is what I would consider to be the most important factor in making a decision around your relationship with him going forward. It's not an easy journey at all but it's necessary for him to address it and for you to see the work he is doing on himself.
Whether you cut contact, support or support from a distance you have still been through trauma so perhaps seeking some help for yourself and potentially doing the inform course through lff might be of benefit to you.
You're not alone in this journey, keep reaching out. Love and strength xxx
I agree with the above.
Sounds like he is minimising and in denial.
If offenders make no effort to tackle the reasons that led to their offending or make no effort to go into therapy then i think their risk level remains High.
The drip drip if information & lies are not fair and hurtful to you so I can see why you're struggling so much.
I would do what you've done. Rigid safety plan and no unsupervised contact.
Above all else put yourself first & ensure that you are looking after your needs and emotional health first.
Hope you're ok.
Sounds like he is minimising and in denial.
If offenders make no effort to tackle the reasons that led to their offending or make no effort to go into therapy then i think their risk level remains High.
The drip drip if information & lies are not fair and hurtful to you so I can see why you're struggling so much.
I would do what you've done. Rigid safety plan and no unsupervised contact.
Above all else put yourself first & ensure that you are looking after your needs and emotional health first.
Hope you're ok.
Thank you both.
The children have actually had very little if any contact with him for a number of years, or indeed with any members of that side of the family. That is for reasons unrelated to this incident The family are toxic and very unpleasant and we made a decision a long time ago not to expose our kids to that. So from my children's perspective there is no real change and they dont really even care or even really think about that side of the family at all. Its kind of sad, but it is what it is - their wellbeing and safety is paramount to me.
They dont know about his offending and at this stage I am not going to tell them, however if he is convicted thats a different matter. I am (mostly) happy to support at a distance. The rest of his family have essentially cut him off completely and he has noone else, but i will do it on my terms, which will not involve him having any contact with the kids. We do have course have regular conversations about online safety and the issues involved with images etc., but we would be doing this rgeardless of their uncle's offending.
He has asked if he can see them, and says things like 'you know I'd never hurt a child dont you'. I think he hasnt actually really twigged what he is asking. To him, I've not excluded him completely and he is quite isolated and vulnerable so I suspect he just feels he would like to devlop a relationship with my kids as he has noone else. Which I get, and I am sure he would not actually harm my kids physically - but thats completely missing the point isnt it. So for the forseeable future he will not be seeing them. He's very childlike in some ways (which is the neurodivergence) and just seems rather baffled by the whole thing.
Its quite sad really as had been diagnosed as a young child and given the proper support he might have had a very different life but way back then in the 1970s neurodivergent kids were told they were stupid rather then recognised having special needs that were managed. Plus his own rather inadequate parents wouldnt have helped, they were only kids themselves when they had him.
I hope it gets reolved one way or the other soon as it just seems to be going on forever. I dont really get a sense of what the outcome is likely to be - and I know every case is different - but I truly cant see how he wont be convicted given what we do know, let alone what we dont. But maybe that might be the wake up call to get the support he has been missing for all these years, who knows...
The children have actually had very little if any contact with him for a number of years, or indeed with any members of that side of the family. That is for reasons unrelated to this incident The family are toxic and very unpleasant and we made a decision a long time ago not to expose our kids to that. So from my children's perspective there is no real change and they dont really even care or even really think about that side of the family at all. Its kind of sad, but it is what it is - their wellbeing and safety is paramount to me.
They dont know about his offending and at this stage I am not going to tell them, however if he is convicted thats a different matter. I am (mostly) happy to support at a distance. The rest of his family have essentially cut him off completely and he has noone else, but i will do it on my terms, which will not involve him having any contact with the kids. We do have course have regular conversations about online safety and the issues involved with images etc., but we would be doing this rgeardless of their uncle's offending.
He has asked if he can see them, and says things like 'you know I'd never hurt a child dont you'. I think he hasnt actually really twigged what he is asking. To him, I've not excluded him completely and he is quite isolated and vulnerable so I suspect he just feels he would like to devlop a relationship with my kids as he has noone else. Which I get, and I am sure he would not actually harm my kids physically - but thats completely missing the point isnt it. So for the forseeable future he will not be seeing them. He's very childlike in some ways (which is the neurodivergence) and just seems rather baffled by the whole thing.
Its quite sad really as had been diagnosed as a young child and given the proper support he might have had a very different life but way back then in the 1970s neurodivergent kids were told they were stupid rather then recognised having special needs that were managed. Plus his own rather inadequate parents wouldnt have helped, they were only kids themselves when they had him.
I hope it gets reolved one way or the other soon as it just seems to be going on forever. I dont really get a sense of what the outcome is likely to be - and I know every case is different - but I truly cant see how he wont be convicted given what we do know, let alone what we dont. But maybe that might be the wake up call to get the support he has been missing for all these years, who knows...
I think the point you made about him saying he'd never harm a real child may be more about having someone who believes he is more than his offending since the rest of his family have walked away from him.
It's good that he has you although important that you look after your own mental health too xx
It's good that he has you although important that you look after your own mental health too xx
I think there are are some people om here who have relatives who are neurodivergent who may be more helpful to you.
I know there are some offenders who have a high level of neurodivergence that really don't have the emotional capability to understand their offending but it really depends on where your person sits on that scale as to how to judge wether it's that or a case of denial or minimisation.
Have they got a support worker they can lean on for support ?
I think you're doing the right thing. Supporting from a distance whilst also ensuring your children are safe & happy..
If you're children have had little to do with that side of the family & they ate toxic, I would keep ang contact to the barest miniminum.
It's a shame that other family members have walked away as it places more pressure on you.
Just do what makes you feel comfortable. Listen to your instincts and above all else ensure that you are looking after yourself.
Sending you love x
I know there are some offenders who have a high level of neurodivergence that really don't have the emotional capability to understand their offending but it really depends on where your person sits on that scale as to how to judge wether it's that or a case of denial or minimisation.
Have they got a support worker they can lean on for support ?
I think you're doing the right thing. Supporting from a distance whilst also ensuring your children are safe & happy..
If you're children have had little to do with that side of the family & they ate toxic, I would keep ang contact to the barest miniminum.
It's a shame that other family members have walked away as it places more pressure on you.
Just do what makes you feel comfortable. Listen to your instincts and above all else ensure that you are looking after yourself.
Sending you love x