Maintaining innocence?
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From what I've read here it seems the majority of men own up to what they have been accused of very quickly after their arrest even if they do try to downplay it. Just wondering how common it is to completely maintain innocence following arrest? And for those who did what was the outcome?
My partner is telling me that he has never received images and is confident that the police will find nothing on his devices. He even refused duty solicitor on the basis that he has done nothing wrong and challenged the police to present him with the supposed image which they couldn't do and just stated that they had credible intelligence that an image exists. Also, there was a period of one month between the initial knock and my OH's arrest and devices being seized, he makes the fair point that if he had got anything illegal on his phone or computer he hasn't used that month to get rid of them.
I understand of course I am only hearing his side of the story at the moment as the police refuse to tell me anything.
My partner is telling me that he has never received images and is confident that the police will find nothing on his devices. He even refused duty solicitor on the basis that he has done nothing wrong and challenged the police to present him with the supposed image which they couldn't do and just stated that they had credible intelligence that an image exists. Also, there was a period of one month between the initial knock and my OH's arrest and devices being seized, he makes the fair point that if he had got anything illegal on his phone or computer he hasn't used that month to get rid of them.
I understand of course I am only hearing his side of the story at the moment as the police refuse to tell me anything.
I think you're right that these cases are few and far between. But some of the case studies here are interesting, a few not guilties and NFAs. I find the last one particularly intereseing. I think the issue is if the offences are committed on your phone it's quite difficult to suggest you can't have done the act yourself even if it was accidental which is really all the law requires.
https://marymonson.co.uk/case-studies/?filter-by=?subcategories=indecent-images?page=1
https://www.kangssolicitors.co.uk/news-insights/indecent-images-allegation-withdrawn/
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/lawyer-cleared-not-guilty-indecent-images-children-cleared-tim-varchmin-chem-sex-parties-barclays-lancaster-gate-flat-raid-a8118171.html
https://marymonson.co.uk/case-studies/?filter-by=?subcategories=indecent-images?page=1
https://www.kangssolicitors.co.uk/news-insights/indecent-images-allegation-withdrawn/
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/lawyer-cleared-not-guilty-indecent-images-children-cleared-tim-varchmin-chem-sex-parties-barclays-lancaster-gate-flat-raid-a8118171.html
We are in a situation where my 16yr old son is on bail whilst devices checked. He's not admitted anything other than he clicked a warning pop up on device and were images but he came off it and we know he's reported things on snapchat that were accepted as violating. My worry with snapchat is I thought it was images people send you and this is why we think its school related. He was model student never in trouble. They only took his devices. The police haven't told us anything. We just have a feeling it's school related reading into bits they said.
My worry is what if something on say iphone but he's had no knowledge it was there. I've read a case where solicitor said admit it because no way to prove otherwise. I also worry how long this will go on for because almost 5 months he still won't sleep in his bed, always with us and jumpy if knock at door. We've had couple of breakdowns where he's said he's no idea what it is.
My worry is what if something on say iphone but he's had no knowledge it was there. I've read a case where solicitor said admit it because no way to prove otherwise. I also worry how long this will go on for because almost 5 months he still won't sleep in his bed, always with us and jumpy if knock at door. We've had couple of breakdowns where he's said he's no idea what it is.
I think this is the problem if you get a solicitor who doesn't specialise in digital evidence/crime. Which really they all should do now because people's mobiles are taken and downloaded for pretty much every major offence.
But even if things are on your mobile there may be a defence available. Was the mobile second-hand? Has anyone else had access to it? Was something backed-up from a computer that more than one person uses? Are there actually images there or has the automated software just recognised the file hash (the unique number attached to each file) because it's already stored on the government database for indecent images.
OH's solicitor had a case where they were trying to charge on a bunch of filenames that were clearly indecent (actually referred to underage content) but the police could not actually access the content of the files to see what the pictures were. After hiring an independent forensics specialist to show this, the CPS had no choice but to discontinue the case.
I also read another case where the guy was arrested for drug offence. Phone download also revealed indecent images. His legal team were able to argue that he often gave his phone as collatoral to his dealer when he couldn't pay for his drugs. They alleged his dealer could equally have accessed the images. Went to trial and there was enough reasonable doubt for the jury to acquit him. Quite a unique case but you can see what the right circumstances and the right legal representation can achieve.
The problem is these things cost money with no guarantee of success. But I would always consult a specialist solicitor, get your person to be honest with them, and see if the specifics of your case merit a not guilty plea.
But even if things are on your mobile there may be a defence available. Was the mobile second-hand? Has anyone else had access to it? Was something backed-up from a computer that more than one person uses? Are there actually images there or has the automated software just recognised the file hash (the unique number attached to each file) because it's already stored on the government database for indecent images.
OH's solicitor had a case where they were trying to charge on a bunch of filenames that were clearly indecent (actually referred to underage content) but the police could not actually access the content of the files to see what the pictures were. After hiring an independent forensics specialist to show this, the CPS had no choice but to discontinue the case.
I also read another case where the guy was arrested for drug offence. Phone download also revealed indecent images. His legal team were able to argue that he often gave his phone as collatoral to his dealer when he couldn't pay for his drugs. They alleged his dealer could equally have accessed the images. Went to trial and there was enough reasonable doubt for the jury to acquit him. Quite a unique case but you can see what the right circumstances and the right legal representation can achieve.
The problem is these things cost money with no guarantee of success. But I would always consult a specialist solicitor, get your person to be honest with them, and see if the specifics of your case merit a not guilty plea.
26a20
Hi, I'm in this situation right now..
We got the knock in Aug this year , my husband was as shocked & upset as I was!
All our family devices were checked by the cyber team & it came back with 1 iioc on his phone dated from 2022 and 4 email addresses linked to it!
He declined a lawyer in his 1st police interview as he had nothing to hide. He was charged because it was his phone & no one else really had access to it. He's still swears he's innocent & I believe him.
OIC said he's no threat to my kids, he was allowed back home ( with supervision) he's low risk & no Social services have been involved. The police even worked his 1st court hearing date around our Christmas holiday abroad that we were allowed to go on , it's all very bizarre.
We are awaiting his 1st court hearing,( 1st one got moved forward on the day) & the lawyer said "best case scenario his case will get dismissed "
This 5 months have been the most stressful time of our lives.
Maybe he has unintentionally opened a link without realising? God knows but he's absolutely adamant he just wouldn't have done that . .
Hi, I'm in this situation right now..
We got the knock in Aug this year , my husband was as shocked & upset as I was!
All our family devices were checked by the cyber team & it came back with 1 iioc on his phone dated from 2022 and 4 email addresses linked to it!
He declined a lawyer in his 1st police interview as he had nothing to hide. He was charged because it was his phone & no one else really had access to it. He's still swears he's innocent & I believe him.
OIC said he's no threat to my kids, he was allowed back home ( with supervision) he's low risk & no Social services have been involved. The police even worked his 1st court hearing date around our Christmas holiday abroad that we were allowed to go on , it's all very bizarre.
We are awaiting his 1st court hearing,( 1st one got moved forward on the day) & the lawyer said "best case scenario his case will get dismissed "
This 5 months have been the most stressful time of our lives.
Maybe he has unintentionally opened a link without realising? God knows but he's absolutely adamant he just wouldn't have done that . .
Hopeful Heart, if it's not thrown out will he be pleading guilty? The making offence does say you are only guilty if when you open the link you thought it did contain or was likely to contain indecent images. I can't imagine the CPS have enough evidence to prove that in the absence of indicative search terms for illegal porn or being on KIK etc (i.e. the usual red flags)
I do recall our solicitor stating if the police found anything then the solicitors had facilities to do their own tests.
We only had the duty solicitor mainly because I didn't have a clue what to expect in the interview etc. So glad we did because solicitor advised my son to fully cooporate. Mainly because my sons email had been hacked and he had set up new email but I didn't know he had used same password and email address was exactly same just different provider.
One thing that came to me though they said it was viewed at our address but they only checked my sons devices. They seemed to know it was his user name. My son could never connect phone to Internet it never or rarely worked so he used data so how could it link to our Internet.
We also recently tried to change a gaming account that we were unaware had the old hacked email address and when we went to retrieve the account we did not recognise the 2nd email address.
Like with the emails we found with snapchat of him reporting items that were accepted as violation I'm keeping screenshot of everything.
We only had the duty solicitor mainly because I didn't have a clue what to expect in the interview etc. So glad we did because solicitor advised my son to fully cooporate. Mainly because my sons email had been hacked and he had set up new email but I didn't know he had used same password and email address was exactly same just different provider.
One thing that came to me though they said it was viewed at our address but they only checked my sons devices. They seemed to know it was his user name. My son could never connect phone to Internet it never or rarely worked so he used data so how could it link to our Internet.
We also recently tried to change a gaming account that we were unaware had the old hacked email address and when we went to retrieve the account we did not recognise the 2nd email address.
Like with the emails we found with snapchat of him reporting items that were accepted as violation I'm keeping screenshot of everything.
Losing it
No, he's pleading not guilty.
Layer says if it goes further he has a good team of forensics that will look further into the phone and see what's gone on and how this has come about.
Why would he plead guilty if he hadn't done it ? I'm just curious you ask ?
No, he's pleading not guilty.
Layer says if it goes further he has a good team of forensics that will look further into the phone and see what's gone on and how this has come about.
Why would he plead guilty if he hadn't done it ? I'm just curious you ask ?
Hopeful Heart,
I think a lot of people are pressured into pleading guilty when they honestly don't know how the images came to be on their phone because of the 1/3 discount you get at sentencing. Also lawyers telling their clients that juries are biased in these sorts of cases. In fairness, the "making" law has been kept purposefully vague and arcane in order to make proving "guilty mind" very easy for the courts. The wording of the law makes no specific references to intent like the modern sexual offence laws.
You sound like you have a very good case though so best of luck with the fight! I really hope we see more sense in how these a prosecuted soon. There was some commentary from the Met Commissioner in 2010s that these low grade cases should be given simple police cautions. But the public mood has shifted so much that the CPS just go full steam ahead now.
I think a lot of people are pressured into pleading guilty when they honestly don't know how the images came to be on their phone because of the 1/3 discount you get at sentencing. Also lawyers telling their clients that juries are biased in these sorts of cases. In fairness, the "making" law has been kept purposefully vague and arcane in order to make proving "guilty mind" very easy for the courts. The wording of the law makes no specific references to intent like the modern sexual offence laws.
You sound like you have a very good case though so best of luck with the fight! I really hope we see more sense in how these a prosecuted soon. There was some commentary from the Met Commissioner in 2010s that these low grade cases should be given simple police cautions. But the public mood has shifted so much that the CPS just go full steam ahead now.
Ajustcopingparent, it sounds like we're both in a similar situation. In my OH case, the police are saying that something has been flagged from August linked to our IP address and my partner's email address. They haven't said who flagged the concern, but we are assuming it is either the internet provider, the email provider, or one of his social media accounts.
Like you he also says he believed his account had been hacked as he suddenly began receiving much more junk mail than usual around that time and he started up a new email account.
Like you he also says he believed his account had been hacked as he suddenly began receiving much more junk mail than usual around that time and he started up a new email account.
Losing it ,
Ahh right I see... Fingers crossed! I'm praying it's a positive outcome. Thank you very much for your reply :)
26a20
We were also Aug, our ip address flagged it up and every single device/ memory cards etc me and my family owned were checked when the knock happened.
Seemingly it was internationally in 2022 which is why it's taken so long to come to light ..
From your question, like you I've read on here that most do own up when they are caught but my OH is absolutely adamant. He's been suicidal over this claim as he's not done this . He has never been in trouble before.
Ahh right I see... Fingers crossed! I'm praying it's a positive outcome. Thank you very much for your reply :)
26a20
We were also Aug, our ip address flagged it up and every single device/ memory cards etc me and my family owned were checked when the knock happened.
Seemingly it was internationally in 2022 which is why it's taken so long to come to light ..
From your question, like you I've read on here that most do own up when they are caught but my OH is absolutely adamant. He's been suicidal over this claim as he's not done this . He has never been in trouble before.
My now ex maintained his innocence for 18 months claiming that he may at most have inadvertently seen some 16/17 years old claiming to be older. I stood by him while investigation was ongoing.
He promised, cried and I watched him like a hawk, convinced myself I'd know if he was lying. He was also suicidal.
No, thousands of images as young as 3 years. I'm a few years on now and I still cannot get my head around a, that he did it and b, that he lied for so long. I don't trust anyone now, a difficult place to be. To be honest, as bad as it seems, it's the lies that have done me the most damage.
He said he hoped there would be no evidence. Thank god there was or I would still be with him.
Hopefully, your outcome will be different. Do what you need to do to get through this but please protect yourself. Xxxx
He promised, cried and I watched him like a hawk, convinced myself I'd know if he was lying. He was also suicidal.
No, thousands of images as young as 3 years. I'm a few years on now and I still cannot get my head around a, that he did it and b, that he lied for so long. I don't trust anyone now, a difficult place to be. To be honest, as bad as it seems, it's the lies that have done me the most damage.
He said he hoped there would be no evidence. Thank god there was or I would still be with him.
Hopefully, your outcome will be different. Do what you need to do to get through this but please protect yourself. Xxxx
Hi 26a20
It sounds exactly the same situation. They told us nothing other than IP address and email is linked to an image. They've said if no image no further action.
Way they spoke it sounded like one image from last October which is when he got snapchat so thats why we thought school related. But then the thing with the hacked email address. The knock was end of July. They also kept saying over and over a child is anyone under age of 18.
My concern over having no information is that he's still a child. We believe his innocence and since put every security and restriction in place and want to protect him but not sure what I'm protecting him from.
It sounds exactly the same situation. They told us nothing other than IP address and email is linked to an image. They've said if no image no further action.
Way they spoke it sounded like one image from last October which is when he got snapchat so thats why we thought school related. But then the thing with the hacked email address. The knock was end of July. They also kept saying over and over a child is anyone under age of 18.
My concern over having no information is that he's still a child. We believe his innocence and since put every security and restriction in place and want to protect him but not sure what I'm protecting him from.